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Just in time compiling
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This message was discovered on ASPFriends.com 'aspng' list.
Responses highlighted in red are from those people who are likely to be able to contribute good, authoratitive information to this discussion. They include Microsoft employees, MVP's and others who IMHO contribute well to these kinds of discussions.

Wong, Guo

I am relatively new to the list, maybe someone had already talk about it...

I am still confusing about the Just in time complier. Does any beachmarks
on it compare with Sun's interpreter in VM. Wouldn't it be eatup
performance while downloading and compiling?

Thanks

guo
Reply to this message...
 
    
Casey Chesnut
.NET is in beta.
Performance tests would be meaningless right now.

-----Original Message-----
From: Wong, Guo [mailto:Click here to reveal e-mail address]
Sent: Monday, May 07, 2001 4:06 PM
To: aspng
Subject: [aspng] Just in time compiling

I am relatively new to the list, maybe someone had already talk about it...

I am still confusing about the Just in time complier. Does any beachmarks
on it compare with Sun's interpreter in VM. Wouldn't it be eatup
performance while downloading and compiling?

Thanks

guo

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Wong, Guo
I am sorry I have to disagree with you. This is one of the most important
part of .Net. And also, a huge decision in MS. I would bet that MS had
done it long ago... Now, i am interesting to look for it is: what's it, and
why?

thanks

guo

-----Original Message-----
From: Casey Chesnut [mailto:Click here to reveal e-mail address]
Sent: Monday, May 07, 2001 2:18 PM
To: aspng
Subject: [aspng] RE: Just in time compiling

.NET is in beta.
Performance tests would be meaningless right now.

-----Original Message-----
From: Wong, Guo [mailto:Click here to reveal e-mail address]
Sent: Monday, May 07, 2001 4:06 PM
To: aspng
Subject: [aspng] Just in time compiling

I am relatively new to the list, maybe someone had already talk about it...

I am still confusing about the Just in time complier. Does any beachmarks
on it compare with Sun's interpreter in VM. Wouldn't it be eatup
performance while downloading and compiling?

Thanks

guo

| [aspng] member Click here to reveal e-mail address = YOUR ID
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Minh Truong
Guo,

Of you've read the end-user license, especially the part that prohibits
benchmarking :)
But seriously, precisely like Casey wrote, beta software can change so much
from version to version that benchmarking couldn't be used to represent
anything real. We'll just have to wait until final release, or at the very
least Beta 2 :)

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wong, Guo" <Click here to reveal e-mail address>
To: "aspng" <Click here to reveal e-mail address>
Sent: Monday, May 07, 2001 5:52 PM
Subject: [aspng] RE: Just in time compiling

[Original message clipped]
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Luis Ferro
From what i heard (and the specifications) the workings of .NET JIT
isn't possible to compare with any Java JIT... They aim at two diferent
things...

.NET JIT compiles code on demand for disk storage
JAVA JIT compiles code on demand for memory

As you can see, the main and huge diference is the target.

I leave to the experts in JIT tech to explain all the consequences of it...

Cheers,
Luis Ferro

Wong, Guo wrote:

[Original message clipped]
Reply to this message...
 
    
Charles Carroll (VIP)
At 10:05 AM 5/8/2001 +0100, you wrote:
[Original message clipped]

One other difference.

Java focuses on a P-code style execution environment where it is executing
high level Java code with cooperation from a JVM.

.NET focuses on converting IL to Machine code optimized for the
CPU/platform. It comes in portable on one side and comes out platform
specific machine code on the other.

This is why SUNs JVM was slower than the JVM Microsoft made for
Intel/windows. SUNs JVM is designed for rapid porting, not highly optimized
code.

Charles M. Carroll, Microsoft MVP
ASP Teacher, disciple of Ries,Trout,Cooper, Weinberg
LearnASP.com creator
AspNG.com creator
ASPlists.com moderator
Aspalliance.com founder
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Scott Swigart
1. I'm not sure where the downloading comes in. There's no "downloading" of
.NET code.

2. With .NET, you take a performance hit on the very first execution of a
web page, or application. After that, it's as fast as a native executable,
because it is a native executable. It doesn't get recompiled every time you
execute it. With Java, you take a performance hit all the time, every time,
because it's always interpretted code.

Scott Swigart
3 Leaf Solutions, LLC
Click here to reveal e-mail address
www.3leafsolutions.com

"Wong, Guo" <Click here to reveal e-mail address> wrote in message news:383037@aspng...
[Original message clipped]
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Paul D. Murphy (VIP)
There is one instance where the client would download code. If you place
a winform control on a web page, when IE loads the page the assembly is
loaded on the client. At this time it goes through the same JIT process
as the first time it is run on the server. If Microsoft pushes support
for the .NET platform onto other operating systems (Which they have said
they will do) you can expect more of this style 'web interface' design.
My understanding of that side of the process is limited, but that's what
I gather from the docs that I have read.

Paul

-----Original Message-----
From: Scott Swigart [mailto:Click here to reveal e-mail address]
Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2001 11:52 AM
To: aspng
Subject: [aspng] Re: Just in time compiling

1. I'm not sure where the downloading comes in. There's no
"downloading" of
.NET code.

2. With .NET, you take a performance hit on the very first execution of
a
web page, or application. After that, it's as fast as a native
executable,
because it is a native executable. It doesn't get recompiled every time
you
execute it. With Java, you take a performance hit all the time, every
time,
because it's always interpretted code.

Scott Swigart
3 Leaf Solutions, LLC
Click here to reveal e-mail address
www.3leafsolutions.com

"Wong, Guo" <Click here to reveal e-mail address> wrote in message news:383037@aspng...
[Original message clipped]

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Alex Ferrara
Is there any way to get around this "performance hit"? Can you specify that
you want the code to be compiled to native executable code at compile time?

Alex

-----Original Message-----
From: Scott Swigart [mailto:Click here to reveal e-mail address]
Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2001 11:52 AM
To: aspng
Subject: [aspng] Re: Just in time compiling

1. I'm not sure where the downloading comes in. There's no "downloading" of
.NET code.

2. With .NET, you take a performance hit on the very first execution of a
web page, or application. After that, it's as fast as a native executable,
because it is a native executable. It doesn't get recompiled every time you
execute it. With Java, you take a performance hit all the time, every time,
because it's always interpretted code.

Scott Swigart
3 Leaf Solutions, LLC
Click here to reveal e-mail address
www.3leafsolutions.com

"Wong, Guo" <Click here to reveal e-mail address> wrote in message news:383037@aspng...
[Original message clipped]

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Daniel Alves
I think there will be one "Install Time JITer"...that way I think that there
woñ't be any impact...

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alex Ferrara" <Click here to reveal e-mail address>
To: "aspng" <Click here to reveal e-mail address>
Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2001 1:05 PM
Subject: [aspng] Re: Just in time compiling

> Is there any way to get around this "performance hit"? Can you specify
that
> you want the code to be compiled to native executable code at compile
time?
[Original message clipped]
Reply to this message...
 
    
Luis Ferro
The download doesn't exist as both .NET and J2EE run in server
machines... that is if the application is the kind of what we all think...

I would like for a change to see some discussion on scalability
issues... specially in cluster environments... anyone has tried to do it
with .NET?
(build web farms and the like???)

Scott Swigart wrote:

[Original message clipped]

The download doesn't exist unless its java applets and then the hit is
equal to activex components... both need to be downloaded...
After that it depends on the way things run...

[Original message clipped]

Performance hit isn't that big as some may assume... The fact that it is
interpreted code isn't the only issue in performance. If you have
compiled code but that it needs to initialize several dll and processes
to do it's job then the performance of "compiled" code can be worst then
interpreted code...

Simple enumeration of vantages and disvantages in a dogmatic way doesn't
show the true natures of both platforms... I for once would like to see
some benchmarks and test cases but alas, one has to wait for the release
code...

Cheers,
Luis Ferro
Reply to this message...
 
 




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